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	<title>Comments on: Where we dwell</title>
	<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/</link>
	<description>Erika Carney Haub's musings on life and God from South Central, L.A.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 18:55:14 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: Erik (no A)</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-158078</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 02:42:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-158078</guid>
					<description>I guess the reason that I felt heated was that it seemed that what you got out of the post was that the first thing that should have been done was to tell them they're bad. 
And I dissagree with that.  
That's all.
erik</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess the reason that I felt heated was that it seemed that what you got out of the post was that the first thing that should have been done was to tell them they&#8217;re bad.<br />
And I dissagree with that.<br />
That&#8217;s all.<br />
erik
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		<title>by: Mary</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-157182</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 May 2008 15:43:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-157182</guid>
					<description>Erika,

My oversight.

Enjoy your day.

Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Erika,</p>
<p>My oversight.</p>
<p>Enjoy your day.</p>
<p>Thanks.
</p>
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		<title>by: erika</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-157063</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 May 2008 07:49:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-157063</guid>
					<description>Mary,

The comment before yours was not from me--I'm not sure if you thought it was but it seemed like there could have been some confusion (one letter difference in the name).

I love the idea of working with the community to create time and space for skateboarding. Maybe Sunday mornings? I have heard of "skate churches" before...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mary,</p>
<p>The comment before yours was not from me&#8211;I&#8217;m not sure if you thought it was but it seemed like there could have been some confusion (one letter difference in the name).</p>
<p>I love the idea of working with the community to create time and space for skateboarding. Maybe Sunday mornings? I have heard of &#8220;skate churches&#8221; before&#8230;
</p>
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		<title>by: Mary</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-157062</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 May 2008 07:32:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-157062</guid>
					<description>I'm not sure why my comments have you heated.  My comments were not intended to do so. My comments were merely food for thought. I hoped that they would encourage you to look outside your box.  

"If we arrested everyone who committed a crime we would ALL be in jail.  My point is that if we were all judged by the letter of the law we wouldn’t stand a chance."  I agree with you. However, I am starting to wonder if you understand the community you live in.

My point is simple, you as a white person trepassing in a tranquil neighborhood school may be overlooked.  Reality, Latinos, Blacks, &#38; other children of color living in the inner city trepassing on school property are more likely to have the law enforced (they don't stand a chance, if caught).  

Hence, we are not all judged by the letter of the law, but some of us are!

I think Nicole asked a good question, if skaters hopped your home fence with out permission to skate would you feel the same. Forgive me for assuming, but I believe you would reach out to them, yet I believe you would also address the issue of trespassing (entering with out permission.

I think you missed the real message, you had an opportunity to educate, protect and "create more light" on their reality, not yours.  

I think people are in need of solutions not excuses.

Here's a thought, why don't you, your church or both talk with the school principal and sponser a few hours a week to skate boarding.  Hopefully, you can provide them with an option that is safer than the side walk and legal.

"The laws/rules about being on a schools property are to protect the property and the liability of the people who own the property. If the kids aren’t doing any harm, and aren’t intentionally skating there so that if they do get hurt they can get rich off of LAUSD, then is it really something to focus on?"  I am not an expert therefore, I encourage you to ask, Police Officers, Parole Officers, Social Services, Judges and those who would know better than you and I.  

Likewise I'm not a biblical scholar. Nevertheless, I think Jesus would have welcomed them, accepted them and taught them right from wrong at the same time.

I’m not saying this to be flippant, (which if you knew me, is quite surprising.)" too.

Finally, we can agree to disagree.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not sure why my comments have you heated.  My comments were not intended to do so. My comments were merely food for thought. I hoped that they would encourage you to look outside your box.  </p>
<p>&#8220;If we arrested everyone who committed a crime we would ALL be in jail.  My point is that if we were all judged by the letter of the law we wouldn’t stand a chance.&#8221;  I agree with you. However, I am starting to wonder if you understand the community you live in.</p>
<p>My point is simple, you as a white person trepassing in a tranquil neighborhood school may be overlooked.  Reality, Latinos, Blacks, &amp; other children of color living in the inner city trepassing on school property are more likely to have the law enforced (they don&#8217;t stand a chance, if caught).  </p>
<p>Hence, we are not all judged by the letter of the law, but some of us are!</p>
<p>I think Nicole asked a good question, if skaters hopped your home fence with out permission to skate would you feel the same. Forgive me for assuming, but I believe you would reach out to them, yet I believe you would also address the issue of trespassing (entering with out permission.</p>
<p>I think you missed the real message, you had an opportunity to educate, protect and &#8220;create more light&#8221; on their reality, not yours.  </p>
<p>I think people are in need of solutions not excuses.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s a thought, why don&#8217;t you, your church or both talk with the school principal and sponser a few hours a week to skate boarding.  Hopefully, you can provide them with an option that is safer than the side walk and legal.</p>
<p>&#8220;The laws/rules about being on a schools property are to protect the property and the liability of the people who own the property. If the kids aren’t doing any harm, and aren’t intentionally skating there so that if they do get hurt they can get rich off of LAUSD, then is it really something to focus on?&#8221;  I am not an expert therefore, I encourage you to ask, Police Officers, Parole Officers, Social Services, Judges and those who would know better than you and I.  </p>
<p>Likewise I&#8217;m not a biblical scholar. Nevertheless, I think Jesus would have welcomed them, accepted them and taught them right from wrong at the same time.</p>
<p>I’m not saying this to be flippant, (which if you knew me, is quite surprising.)&#8221; too.</p>
<p>Finally, we can agree to disagree.
</p>
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		<title>by: Erik</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-157017</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 May 2008 04:32:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-157017</guid>
					<description>How can i resisit..

Mary,
I will try to create more light and not more heat, but we'll see how i do.

As a former Jr. High Skater, given a choice of skating in a school yard and skating on the sidewalk, where i would run a serious risk of getting shot, I'd choose the former every time. Even if there was a risk I could get kicked out. 
If we arrested everyone who committed a crime we would ALL be in jail.
I'm not saying this to be flippant, (which if you knew me, is quite surprising.) My point is that if we were all judged by the letter of the law we wouldn't stand a chance. It is the spirit of the law that is the important part. Should we arrest everyone who drives 56mph in a 55? Should we arrest the people that drive 50 in a 55? (I lean towards yes on the later, serously people). Back to my point; The laws/rules about being on a schools property are to protect the property and the liability of the people who own the property. If the kids aren't doing any harm, and aren't intentionally skating there so that if they do get hurt they can get rich off of LAUSD, then is it really something to focus on? Or maybe should we really focus on the part of the story about kids who have very few safe places to be finding a safe place to hang out with some church kids near a church.
I'm not a biblical scholar by any means, but i think Jesus would have met them where they were at and likely not even brougt up their "trespasses".</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How can i resisit..</p>
<p>Mary,<br />
I will try to create more light and not more heat, but we&#8217;ll see how i do.</p>
<p>As a former Jr. High Skater, given a choice of skating in a school yard and skating on the sidewalk, where i would run a serious risk of getting shot, I&#8217;d choose the former every time. Even if there was a risk I could get kicked out.<br />
If we arrested everyone who committed a crime we would ALL be in jail.<br />
I&#8217;m not saying this to be flippant, (which if you knew me, is quite surprising.) My point is that if we were all judged by the letter of the law we wouldn&#8217;t stand a chance. It is the spirit of the law that is the important part. Should we arrest everyone who drives 56mph in a 55? Should we arrest the people that drive 50 in a 55? (I lean towards yes on the later, serously people). Back to my point; The laws/rules about being on a schools property are to protect the property and the liability of the people who own the property. If the kids aren&#8217;t doing any harm, and aren&#8217;t intentionally skating there so that if they do get hurt they can get rich off of LAUSD, then is it really something to focus on? Or maybe should we really focus on the part of the story about kids who have very few safe places to be finding a safe place to hang out with some church kids near a church.<br />
I&#8217;m not a biblical scholar by any means, but i think Jesus would have met them where they were at and likely not even brougt up their &#8220;trespasses&#8221;.
</p>
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		<title>by: Nicole</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155406</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 May 2008 22:45:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155406</guid>
					<description>Hello all-

In reading some of Erika's blog I feel that you live in fear of your community. When indeed your purpose is to reach out to your community. I think in this case you missed a great opportunity. It was not a coincidence the kids hopped that fence at that time it was a purpose. A purpose for your need to invite them into your world. Maybe it would have been easier if you had food at that moment. Or maybe you could have said you know we do not have food this time, but how about coming back next time for spirtual and flesh feeding. Maybe that was your ice breaker. 

As far as was it a crime what they did? Let me ask the question in this way. If they hopped the fence to your backyard to do some innocent skateboarding. Would you feel the same? Would you still view it as it could be worse? Would you join them? Would yo say hey you are on my property get out?

These are my thoughts. I like to view both sides of situations. I am one from the Hood as some may say and always try to find a positive. :)

Hope everyone has a good day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello all-</p>
<p>In reading some of Erika&#8217;s blog I feel that you live in fear of your community. When indeed your purpose is to reach out to your community. I think in this case you missed a great opportunity. It was not a coincidence the kids hopped that fence at that time it was a purpose. A purpose for your need to invite them into your world. Maybe it would have been easier if you had food at that moment. Or maybe you could have said you know we do not have food this time, but how about coming back next time for spirtual and flesh feeding. Maybe that was your ice breaker. </p>
<p>As far as was it a crime what they did? Let me ask the question in this way. If they hopped the fence to your backyard to do some innocent skateboarding. Would you feel the same? Would you still view it as it could be worse? Would you join them? Would yo say hey you are on my property get out?</p>
<p>These are my thoughts. I like to view both sides of situations. I am one from the Hood as some may say and always try to find a positive. <img src='http://erika.haub.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Hope everyone has a good day.
</p>
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		<title>by: Jon</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155258</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 May 2008 19:25:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155258</guid>
					<description>Good Convo

Hello I hope you don't mind me joining in dude.  I'm in my senior year at usc, a soc major and a kid from the hood.  Basically, people called us poor white 
trash.  The police are not kind to us.  
What other kids could dude in elite area is not what we could do in poor area even if it is as simple as hopping the school yard for some fun.  I think it is totally wrong.  

Through my studies and internships (l.a. parole office) I find one of the best thing we can do for these kids is prepare them for reality especially their reality. 

I hope things change dude.  Stay Strong</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good Convo</p>
<p>Hello I hope you don&#8217;t mind me joining in dude.  I&#8217;m in my senior year at usc, a soc major and a kid from the hood.  Basically, people called us poor white<br />
trash.  The police are not kind to us.<br />
What other kids could dude in elite area is not what we could do in poor area even if it is as simple as hopping the school yard for some fun.  I think it is totally wrong.  </p>
<p>Through my studies and internships (l.a. parole office) I find one of the best thing we can do for these kids is prepare them for reality especially their reality. </p>
<p>I hope things change dude.  Stay Strong
</p>
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		<title>by: Ali BG</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155225</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 May 2008 17:42:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155225</guid>
					<description>Hmmm.  I think I'm in the "perhaps" camp, too.

Truthfully, I can't help but wonder if hopping the school fence to skate is actually part of preventing these young ones from other, more destructive habits.  

In my posh university town, students often go into school yards to skate or practice jumps or play catch.  They're not prosecuted as criminals, they're looked on as young people finding space--some of the only safe and available public spaces--to do what kids do: play. 

I've even seen an officer join in the fun once in a while...though it's true, I can't imagine the LAPD demonstrating that kind of gentleness.  But that may be a stereotype I have of the LAPD...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmm.  I think I&#8217;m in the &#8220;perhaps&#8221; camp, too.</p>
<p>Truthfully, I can&#8217;t help but wonder if hopping the school fence to skate is actually part of preventing these young ones from other, more destructive habits.  </p>
<p>In my posh university town, students often go into school yards to skate or practice jumps or play catch.  They&#8217;re not prosecuted as criminals, they&#8217;re looked on as young people finding space&#8211;some of the only safe and available public spaces&#8211;to do what kids do: play. </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve even seen an officer join in the fun once in a while&#8230;though it&#8217;s true, I can&#8217;t imagine the LAPD demonstrating that kind of gentleness.  But that may be a stereotype I have of the LAPD&#8230;
</p>
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		<title>by: Mary</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155221</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 May 2008 16:40:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155221</guid>
					<description>Colby,

First, I fully understand the concept of "slippery slope."  You are right I miss spoke ,hopping a school fence is not a stepping stone it is actually an criminal activity.



"It is vital to note the distinction between crime and delinquency. Where as a crime is an act that breaks criminal code which is created by society though written law, delinquency and deviance can be acts that merely break 'cultural law' or norms."

Please note the difference.

Trespassing is a crime.  It is absurd to think because you break into school property to ride your skate board is OKAY and not crime.  I assure if caught School Police is required to arrest.

It is absurd not to teach these kids that right from wrong. It is better that Erika and her community step in than LAPD or School Police.  TRUST ME!

My slippery slope mistake is that I implied that they would become criminals. They are criminals according to the Law.

I did not write the laws.

P.S.  Sometimes it is easier for people to have real relationships and conversations when they are not distracted with hunger.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Colby,</p>
<p>First, I fully understand the concept of &#8220;slippery slope.&#8221;  You are right I miss spoke ,hopping a school fence is not a stepping stone it is actually an criminal activity.</p>
<p>&#8220;It is vital to note the distinction between crime and delinquency. Where as a crime is an act that breaks criminal code which is created by society though written law, delinquency and deviance can be acts that merely break &#8216;cultural law&#8217; or norms.&#8221;</p>
<p>Please note the difference.</p>
<p>Trespassing is a crime.  It is absurd to think because you break into school property to ride your skate board is OKAY and not crime.  I assure if caught School Police is required to arrest.</p>
<p>It is absurd not to teach these kids that right from wrong. It is better that Erika and her community step in than LAPD or School Police.  TRUST ME!</p>
<p>My slippery slope mistake is that I implied that they would become criminals. They are criminals according to the Law.</p>
<p>I did not write the laws.</p>
<p>P.S.  Sometimes it is easier for people to have real relationships and conversations when they are not distracted with hunger.
</p>
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		<title>by: erika</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155208</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 May 2008 14:46:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://erika.haub.net/where-we-dwell/05/#comment-155208</guid>
					<description>Colby,

The food is exactly that: one way of practicing hospitality; of inviting them to join our family and to share a meal; To talk. 

Teenage boys and food usually go well together :)

My milk and honey comment spoke to our physical realities in the here and now: my neighbors are not enjoying physical riches and feasts in a land that is plentiful (by Western standards at least--by global standards we are in fact the rich). 

I do think there is a day coming when my neighbors who are hungry will not be; where those who are in pain will not be; where all of us who mourn will stop. 

Jesus work is complete and yet we live in a creation that still groans for its redemption to be fully realized.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Colby,</p>
<p>The food is exactly that: one way of practicing hospitality; of inviting them to join our family and to share a meal; To talk. </p>
<p>Teenage boys and food usually go well together <img src='http://erika.haub.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>My milk and honey comment spoke to our physical realities in the here and now: my neighbors are not enjoying physical riches and feasts in a land that is plentiful (by Western standards at least&#8211;by global standards we are in fact the rich). </p>
<p>I do think there is a day coming when my neighbors who are hungry will not be; where those who are in pain will not be; where all of us who mourn will stop. </p>
<p>Jesus work is complete and yet we live in a creation that still groans for its redemption to be fully realized.
</p>
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