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	<title>Comments on: The least</title>
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	<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/</link>
	<description>Erika Carney Haub's musings on life and God from South Central, L.A.</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 02:51:29 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Brenna</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-112364</link>
		<dc:creator>Brenna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Feb 2008 13:40:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-112364</guid>
		<description>As a children's minister, I value my nursery and children's worship leaders. They never get enough recognition and thank you's. 
Our church is small but we do have a faithful list of volunteers for the nursery and children's worship.
Our children participate in the regular worship service during the music portion then leave for their own worship ... more kid-friendly that allows for more movement and interaction on their learning levels.
I like to offer a nursery for those parents who need time to enjoy worship without worrying about their little ones and having to occupy them while that is taking their own minds and hearts away from hearing the message. It's also good for the preschoolers to learn and hear lessons on their levels from someone different from the parents ... it branches them out away from the primary care-givers and gives them additional role models.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a children&#8217;s minister, I value my nursery and children&#8217;s worship leaders. They never get enough recognition and thank you&#8217;s.<br />
Our church is small but we do have a faithful list of volunteers for the nursery and children&#8217;s worship.<br />
Our children participate in the regular worship service during the music portion then leave for their own worship &#8230; more kid-friendly that allows for more movement and interaction on their learning levels.<br />
I like to offer a nursery for those parents who need time to enjoy worship without worrying about their little ones and having to occupy them while that is taking their own minds and hearts away from hearing the message. It&#8217;s also good for the preschoolers to learn and hear lessons on their levels from someone different from the parents &#8230; it branches them out away from the primary care-givers and gives them additional role models.</p>
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		<title>By: Xochitl</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-111961</link>
		<dc:creator>Xochitl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Feb 2008 06:12:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-111961</guid>
		<description>Hi, 

I just wanted to offer that I read a great book on the subject - a book that takes seriously the inclusion and participation of children in all aspect of church life; "Welcoming Children: A Practical Theology of Childhood," by Joyce Ann Mercer. She starts by considering a theology of childhood and builds from there. I think it would be a great resource that if taken seriously could contribute to our church's transformation toward greater love, welcome and participatory inclusion of children.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, </p>
<p>I just wanted to offer that I read a great book on the subject - a book that takes seriously the inclusion and participation of children in all aspect of church life; &#8220;Welcoming Children: A Practical Theology of Childhood,&#8221; by Joyce Ann Mercer. She starts by considering a theology of childhood and builds from there. I think it would be a great resource that if taken seriously could contribute to our church&#8217;s transformation toward greater love, welcome and participatory inclusion of children.</p>
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		<title>By: Candace</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-111862</link>
		<dc:creator>Candace</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 22:17:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-111862</guid>
		<description>We have sung at a nearby church several times, and I'm surprised each time at how they value our children.  They only see our children maybe twice a year at their church, but they remember their names, and at least twenty people greet Max and Echo by name and at their level.  Not only that, but beginning at age one, in the various nurseries, there is a worship time and a bible lesson.  I spoke with the young woman who led the two year old class for three years before she moved to CA; her main hesitation in moving was to make sure her class had great leadership once she was gone.  I learned so much from her earnestness and passion that two year olds could fully begin to grasp the message of Jesus, and that no age is too young to begin training disciples.  

Truthfully, I was ashamed of my own previous views of nursery and children's church (a place for the kids to be entertained or worse, babysat, while the grown-ups go to church).  Since coming into relationship with this other church, I have sought ways to emulate their passions and behaviors at home, and begin to look more closely at how our home church is eqipping the little ones...

On a more personal note, we totally relate to Doug being comfortable with his child at his side as he leads worship.  We love it when our children join us when we're helping out, whether that's making someone food or leading worship.  We also relate to your observations that somehow they are not welcome when we're up front--that there is, in fact, no place for young ones, which implies that there is a separation between those up front in worship and those in the congregation.  This is upsetting to me on so many levels....

That said, one of the greatest ways our pastor has ministered to us since we had children was holding Max while we did sound checks, letting Echo touch his glasses and be entertained by his voice while we tuned up the worship band, and last week, by getting down on his level and answering Max's latest theological question, "Why can't we visit God's apartment?"  There is great ministry to our children in personal ways...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We have sung at a nearby church several times, and I&#8217;m surprised each time at how they value our children.  They only see our children maybe twice a year at their church, but they remember their names, and at least twenty people greet Max and Echo by name and at their level.  Not only that, but beginning at age one, in the various nurseries, there is a worship time and a bible lesson.  I spoke with the young woman who led the two year old class for three years before she moved to CA; her main hesitation in moving was to make sure her class had great leadership once she was gone.  I learned so much from her earnestness and passion that two year olds could fully begin to grasp the message of Jesus, and that no age is too young to begin training disciples.  </p>
<p>Truthfully, I was ashamed of my own previous views of nursery and children&#8217;s church (a place for the kids to be entertained or worse, babysat, while the grown-ups go to church).  Since coming into relationship with this other church, I have sought ways to emulate their passions and behaviors at home, and begin to look more closely at how our home church is eqipping the little ones&#8230;</p>
<p>On a more personal note, we totally relate to Doug being comfortable with his child at his side as he leads worship.  We love it when our children join us when we&#8217;re helping out, whether that&#8217;s making someone food or leading worship.  We also relate to your observations that somehow they are not welcome when we&#8217;re up front&#8211;that there is, in fact, no place for young ones, which implies that there is a separation between those up front in worship and those in the congregation.  This is upsetting to me on so many levels&#8230;.</p>
<p>That said, one of the greatest ways our pastor has ministered to us since we had children was holding Max while we did sound checks, letting Echo touch his glasses and be entertained by his voice while we tuned up the worship band, and last week, by getting down on his level and answering Max&#8217;s latest theological question, &#8220;Why can&#8217;t we visit God&#8217;s apartment?&#8221;  There is great ministry to our children in personal ways&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: erika</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-111558</link>
		<dc:creator>erika</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 04:41:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-111558</guid>
		<description>Sonja,

Beautifully put. Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sonja,</p>
<p>Beautifully put. Thanks.</p>
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		<title>By: erika</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-111557</link>
		<dc:creator>erika</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 04:41:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-111557</guid>
		<description>Julia,

I can only imagine what the single people would say if WE moved into Fuller housing...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Julia,</p>
<p>I can only imagine what the single people would say if WE moved into Fuller housing&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: erika</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-111556</link>
		<dc:creator>erika</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 04:40:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-111556</guid>
		<description>Sarah,

I totally relate to how you describe being distracted on Sundays. That is the word that sums it up for me too. There was a spell last year when I just dreaded Sunday mornings. It was my most stressful time of the week! And oh how I am learning that my spirituality is my whole life and not a set of rituals and routines that have become largely obsolete with three little ones :) Not that there won't be days of silence and fasting and retreat again...I know they will come only too soon. But for now, it is that other very earthy spirituality of diapers and play.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sarah,</p>
<p>I totally relate to how you describe being distracted on Sundays. That is the word that sums it up for me too. There was a spell last year when I just dreaded Sunday mornings. It was my most stressful time of the week! And oh how I am learning that my spirituality is my whole life and not a set of rituals and routines that have become largely obsolete with three little ones <img src='http://erika.haub.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> Not that there won&#8217;t be days of silence and fasting and retreat again&#8230;I know they will come only too soon. But for now, it is that other very earthy spirituality of diapers and play.</p>
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		<title>By: erika</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-111554</link>
		<dc:creator>erika</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Feb 2008 04:37:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-111554</guid>
		<description>Thanks, all, for the wonderful responses here. It's a challenge, isn't it? To really understand God's heart for all of his children (young and old!) and imagine how our life together can reflect that well..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, all, for the wonderful responses here. It&#8217;s a challenge, isn&#8217;t it? To really understand God&#8217;s heart for all of his children (young and old!) and imagine how our life together can reflect that well..</p>
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		<title>By: Heather</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-111369</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 14:53:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-111369</guid>
		<description>When we started having babies, we were at a church that we now know was unique -- the leaders' modeling of a real heart for selflessness led others to share their time and lives in ways that were definitely an irresistable aroma. Young mothers were RARELY asked to serve in the nursery. The volunteer sheet was full of elderly women and middle-aged women and teenagers who wanted to give us all a break and love on our children. You know there's nothing like that. Children were welcome in all services, and once our hands got really full (5 babies in 4.5 years), people in the pews around us would catch our eye and put their hands out and ask to hold our baby twins, or offer coloring supplies to our toddlers, or just help, or just smile. 

When we moved, we realized that although our new church was full of loving well-intentioned believers, the pervasive attitude was one of serving the worship "experience". Young mothers were the ONLY ones serving in the nursery, and they were usually lined up sitting against the walls in an exhausted stupor while the children played. Whoever had gotten the most sleep the night before tried to encourage the others, but conversations often descended into cynicism and complaining. The focus on the "service" was because, I believe, the congregation felt that they were trying to reach unbelievers who might be there any given morning. We understood, but my husband and I didn't really see that in all the "one anothers" in the new testament. 

Maybe because our children came so quickly and closely, we learned very quickly that our "meeting together" had to be about encouraging and serving others, and not about focusing on "getting something out of the service." We really don't want our kids to be shuttled off and entertained, or like you said, a "duty" to be dealt with so the smart big people can follow the order in the bulletin with no snags. If we all want to be "real" and "authentic" in our worship, well, it doesn't get any more authentic than children. : )</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When we started having babies, we were at a church that we now know was unique &#8212; the leaders&#8217; modeling of a real heart for selflessness led others to share their time and lives in ways that were definitely an irresistable aroma. Young mothers were RARELY asked to serve in the nursery. The volunteer sheet was full of elderly women and middle-aged women and teenagers who wanted to give us all a break and love on our children. You know there&#8217;s nothing like that. Children were welcome in all services, and once our hands got really full (5 babies in 4.5 years), people in the pews around us would catch our eye and put their hands out and ask to hold our baby twins, or offer coloring supplies to our toddlers, or just help, or just smile. </p>
<p>When we moved, we realized that although our new church was full of loving well-intentioned believers, the pervasive attitude was one of serving the worship &#8220;experience&#8221;. Young mothers were the ONLY ones serving in the nursery, and they were usually lined up sitting against the walls in an exhausted stupor while the children played. Whoever had gotten the most sleep the night before tried to encourage the others, but conversations often descended into cynicism and complaining. The focus on the &#8220;service&#8221; was because, I believe, the congregation felt that they were trying to reach unbelievers who might be there any given morning. We understood, but my husband and I didn&#8217;t really see that in all the &#8220;one anothers&#8221; in the new testament. </p>
<p>Maybe because our children came so quickly and closely, we learned very quickly that our &#8220;meeting together&#8221; had to be about encouraging and serving others, and not about focusing on &#8220;getting something out of the service.&#8221; We really don&#8217;t want our kids to be shuttled off and entertained, or like you said, a &#8220;duty&#8221; to be dealt with so the smart big people can follow the order in the bulletin with no snags. If we all want to be &#8220;real&#8221; and &#8220;authentic&#8221; in our worship, well, it doesn&#8217;t get any more authentic than children. : )</p>
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		<title>By: sonja</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-111349</link>
		<dc:creator>sonja</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 13:25:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-111349</guid>
		<description>I long for the day when we can understand that worshiping and hearing the word of God is not a college lecture that must be attended to silently and in rows.  It's not for adults only.  I long for the day when it can be a multi-generational affair where the children can be children, and the adults can enjoy them, and each other and God all at the same time and in the same space.  We have such a small box in which we place the ideas of worship and Sunday mornings.  I wonder what it might look like if we opened it up a little to let everyone in together ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I long for the day when we can understand that worshiping and hearing the word of God is not a college lecture that must be attended to silently and in rows.  It&#8217;s not for adults only.  I long for the day when it can be a multi-generational affair where the children can be children, and the adults can enjoy them, and each other and God all at the same time and in the same space.  We have such a small box in which we place the ideas of worship and Sunday mornings.  I wonder what it might look like if we opened it up a little to let everyone in together &#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah Lindquist Swanson</title>
		<link>http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/comment-page-1/#comment-111229</link>
		<dc:creator>Sarah Lindquist Swanson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 03:53:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://erika.haub.net/the-least/02/#comment-111229</guid>
		<description>I can relate. Though caring for only two small children, one of them escaped my grasp at our Ash Wednesday service last week. She too, ended up in the front of the Sanctuary with her dad greeting the church. "Hi, Dad!", she said. Thankfully, I noticed mostly grins and understanding as I walked her to the back. I am thankful for those who have been willing to serve in our church nursery. We have also been blessed with a growing number of babies and cries and coos are welcomed in our worship. What a blessing! However, I must admit, I have been missing out on some  of the worship experience because I sometimes become distracted trying to keep it all together.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can relate. Though caring for only two small children, one of them escaped my grasp at our Ash Wednesday service last week. She too, ended up in the front of the Sanctuary with her dad greeting the church. &#8220;Hi, Dad!&#8221;, she said. Thankfully, I noticed mostly grins and understanding as I walked her to the back. I am thankful for those who have been willing to serve in our church nursery. We have also been blessed with a growing number of babies and cries and coos are welcomed in our worship. What a blessing! However, I must admit, I have been missing out on some  of the worship experience because I sometimes become distracted trying to keep it all together.</p>
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